Seiko 7A38 - by the numbers

By my reckoning this YJ auction for a very tidy looking example of a 7A28-7090 Yacht Timer should have ended around 1:00pm GMT, but it looks like it was extended because of late bids placed:

http://page4.auctions.yahoo.co.jp/jp/auction/d150435832

◎セイコー　ヨットタイマー　クロノグラフ　美品

I took that screen print with 10 minutes left to run, but that's how it ended - at 53,500 Yen, after 48 bids by 19 different bidders. 

Equivalent to $528 USD / £315.60 GBP - so not a bad price at all, given the apparent condition and number of people vying for it.

Say compared to the NOS example which sold in December (previous page) for 83,800 Yen (approx. $815 USD / £498.50 GBP).

Note also that this seller hadn't included the model number in the listing title - it only appeared in the Excel format description:

Incidentally, there is a thread over on SCWF discussing recent auctions for the 7A28-7090 Yacht Timer:

http://www.thewatchsite.com/21-japanese-watch-discussion-forum/84682-anybody-see.html (title is actually: Anybody see this ?)

Though how the posters and people who allegedly run the SCWF expect anybody to ever find anything from their moronic 'click bait' thread titles is completely beyond me. 

It starts off with a botched-up (ex-Philippines) example with a water-damaged dial that sold on eBay in February for $267:

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/161227782495

As you may have gathered from my sarcastic scribblings over 7 pages in the The 7A28-7120 RAF Gen. 1 PriceWatch thread ....

I don't hold these watches in any particular high regard - they're 'two a penny' - even though they may sell for 'a pretty penny'.

Common as muck over here in Blighty.  But what happens when one pops up on Yahoo Japan auctions ? 

This average looking example was listed on YJ yesterday. Already bidding is @ 60,000 Yen (that's £350 GBP / $580 USD). 

http://page18.auctions.yahoo.co.jp/jp/auction/w97699094

SEIKO 初代7A28 ジウジアーロ クロノグラフ イギリス軍

A Google translation of the seller's description reads:

It is a military watch Seiko 1980s had been delivered to the British Army.

I am equipped with a machine name Cal 7A28 which was also used in the Speedmaster series famous Seiko Giugiaro Design.

(It indicates that you have used the promethium is a fluorescent paint) P mark at 12:00, (mark of the British government) Broad Arrow has entered the back cover.

Spring bars are welded to the body like a direct military.

It is a rare small number of very watch.

10X lug width 20mm thickness 37X Diameter: size.

Belt: market goods NATO military type with.

Condition: There is a slight small wound but not especially remarkable wound.

It becomes the clock very rare you do not have production right now.

I think also state's beautiful person fairly.

We have confirmed the operation, but there is not a problem at all.

It looks like it may be a reserve price auction (opening bid price was 5000 Yen). Not entirely clear (limited understanding of Japanese).

There are currently only two bidders. Otherwise why would one of them have placed 50+ bids ?  See Yahoo Japan bidding log here.

That YJ auction for the 7A28-7120 finished a couple of minutes ago @ 13:54 GMT - it was originally scheduled to end @ 13:39 GMT.

http://page18.auctions.yahoo.co.jp/jp/auction/w97699094

But as I'd suspected, due to late bids placed, it was extended (twice as best I can figure out) - No in fact it was extended 3 times.

That's how it ended - @ 80,000 Yen (equivalent to approx. £474 GBP / $789 USD) after 67 bids by 5 different bidders.

I haven't updated this thread in a couple of months. That's not to say there hasn't been anything of interest 7Axx-wise listed on Yahoo Japan auctions - there certainly has, but I've written about them in other threads. For those of you who watch YJ, I thought it might be worth mentioning the Japanese consignment seller Quick-Do (user ID quickdo2), who's been turning up a few interesting 7Axx's lately.

A couple I specifically remember were a stainless 7A38-6090 (fitted with an incorrect replacement bracelet):

And of course the JDM 7A38-7110 which now takes pride of place in one of my collection boxes. 

The problem with Quick-Do is that they're a YJ 'STORE' seller ....

which appears to give them full rein to include as much irrelevant advertising crap in their listings as could be humanly possible. 

To find the photos and details of what you're interested in, here's just a sample of the crap you'll have to scroll through on one listing:

Their latest offering is something a little more run-of-the-mill - commonly found in Europe and the States, but rarely seen in Japan,

a stainless 7A38-7270. Here's the relevant parts of Quick-Do's current listing (with apologies for the bits of pink I have included). 

http://page22.auctions.yahoo.co.jp/jp/auction/l239210142

セイコー 腕時計 クロノグラフ メンズ 黒文字盤 クォーツ SV系

The opening bid price of 25,000 Yen (including 8% Japanese VAT) is equivalent to £145 GBP / $244 USD.

Probably due to all the crap embedded in the listing, Google was initially reluctant to translate the page. Here's the next part:

Couple of things to be careful of. Although overall it appears to be a fairly tidy example, typically for a pre-owned Japanese watch, the bracelet is woefully short of adjustment links. The standard 25mm long 5-hole adjustment SQ clasp is already fitted with an extender.

Also those 'little scratches' (dings ?) visible in the last image on the crown side of the case might bear closer scrutiny. 

 I haven't seen a 7A28-7160 Honda F1 on Yahoo Japan in a few months. Anyway, here's one that was listed yesterday:

http://page7.auctions.yahoo.co.jp/jp/auction/g141229393

限定【HONDA】ホンダ F-1レーシング 7A28-7160 電交済☆動作不良

As usual, Google doesn't do a particularly good job of translating the formatted Japanese description, but it sounds like it has issues:

[SEIKO × HONDA] F-1 GRAND-PRIX RACING TEAM 7A28-7160 chronograph battery already replaced ☆ malfunction ~ ~ limited

※ We are currently running, but there can be time-shifted. In addition, I tender only person who can acknowledge other, we will not guarantee even if there is a problem.

※ It is the battery has been replaced by June 19, Tokyo clock shop 2014.

Silver Dial: Silver Black × 

(Excluding crown) about W40 × H40mm arm circumference: about 16.5cm

Quartz. camera back belt: SS. No 

HONDA WATER RESISTANT 10BAR STAINLESS STEEL 7A28-7160 

929595

There thin scratches on the 1:00, 5:00, 9:00 per windshield. Scratch dirt conspicuous on the face is not found. There is a small scratch dirt on the back cover Case belt. Movement of the crown was able to confirm the change of time is good, but because the usage is not know, we do not confirm the operation of all functions at the touch of a button. We are currently running, but there can be time-shifted. Bid ask only person who understands.

※ difference occurs in color by the environment of the monitor. Also, I think with regard to the condition of the item, and you want to represent as much as possible, please note that there is also a part that can not be told.

It is a model of collaboration and SEIKO HONDA made ​​ around 89. In a rare F-1GP racing team models with 7A28 movement, has been designed in the motif instrument panel of F-1. It is the various exhibiting elsewhere. Thanks in advance.

※ Unless otherwise stated, such as purchase time is unknown.

※ In the case of more than one bid, can be bundled when it was five days it has, including the successful bid day.

If the size change, postage or been changed, it can not cope because there is, Please note the number of bundled, more by the content.

※ Because you do not believe that a prompt decision, even if I have a question from inquiry, please understand that I do not reply.

Might make for a cheap fixer-upper, but the short bracelet is going to need a clasp extender. 

I'm sometimes intrigued by Seiko 7Axx listings which appear on Yahoo Japan auctions that have been given the 'Junk Treatment'. 

Take this cosmetically decent looking 7A28-7090 Yacht Timer, on original rubber strap that was listed by a 'Store Seller' on Friday.

http://page12.auctions.yahoo.co.jp/jp/auction/p409920810

【横浜古物】 セイコー ヨットタイマー 7A28‐7090　ジャンク品

The relevant part of the description reads:

Description of item 

◎ is 38 mm case width.

◎ It does not work even if I put the battery.

◎ Please give me junk treatment, part removing, no claim, no return.

◎ dirt, scrub is appearance. 

◎ The product will be only thing that is reflected in the photograph.

(Excluding cases in which to compare the size.)

Makes me wonder what's actually wrong with it. Even if a movement swap was needed, it might make for a decent fixer-upper. 

I've already posted this in another thread in this forum section yesterday, but as I'm about to add another post to this YJ thread ....

I guess it won't do any harm to duplicate it here, so here's a straight copy and paste:

*** WARNING *** Serious  7A28 FRANKEN  alert for Yahoo Japan watchers / potential bidders.

I had to do a double take on this thing, listed on YJ yesterday evening. 

Bidding is already @ 31,500 Yen, with 5 days of the listing still to run, so someone's certainly going to get caught out by it. 

http://page19.auctions.yahoo.co.jp/jp/auction/x351490830

希少・美品！SEIKO スピードマスター 7Ａ28-7Ａ00 ジウジアーロ

Google translates the seller's Japanese formatted description as follows:

As you can see (also by my image captions), I'd initially honed in on the bracelet - it's obviously off a JDM 7A28-6000 'Bishop' ....

But then I noticed the dial didn't look quite right either. That's also the (7A286000X999) dial out of a 7A28-6000 SAY048 'Bishop'.

Here's what a 7A28-7A00 SBBJ005 Giugiaro should look like. Note the offset dial printing and the matching grey plastic bracelet:

Plenty more photos in this thread besides: http://www.seiko7a38.com/apps/forums/topics/show/7489709 What is this 7A28 ?

Funny thing (it must be the 'London Buses' syndrome), but no sooner than you write something like:

I haven't seen a 7A28-7160 Honda F1 on Yahoo Japan in a few months .... another one comes along. 

Here's one I spotted listed earlier today by a YJ 'Store Seller' (hence the lurid green floral background wallpaper).

http://page24.auctions.yahoo.co.jp/jp/auction/q35833297 

定価8万【セイコーHondaホンダレーシングクロノ7A28】

Google translates the seller's description (and all the customary caveats) as follows:

[Product name] Seiko Honda Honda Racing Chronograph 7A28

[Comment] HONDA direct marketing was selling around 89.

It is a chronograph watch HONDA Racing. It is a fairly rare model.

[Price] 81,000 yen

[Drive] quartz chronograph

[Wrist size] Approximately 19cm around the arm genuine.

[Accuracy and operation] confirmed, no problem.

[Accessories] None.

[Condition] There is a feeling of use, such as scratches sand scratches on the whole fairly old watch.

☆ I have sent to the Yahoo auction as business antiquary.

☆ Please note the following. Including the unused ones, exhibited commodity, all secondhand goods becomes.

- It is within the tax. You do not need to burden consumption tax because it is included in the highest bid.

· Product is current sales. Waterproof is outside the scope of returned or security because we do not do waterproof inspection.

And waterproof notation of the legend does not guarantee the waterproof performance of the actual new ones at that time.

Commodity is selling out as soon as bid. It does not do the middle or end prompt decision.

Shipping is Kuroneko Yamato. Shipping is 1000 yen nationwide.

Payment only supports simple settlement (JNB, Yokohama) and bank transfer.

• If we do not do the answers from the Q & A form on the WEB on our side [question].

Please contact us on the specify the product name to e-mail address below to contact us.

Is not possible to receive the return of the customer convenience with respect to [return].

If there is a problem or waterproof derived from other than the goods that arrived, there was a significant difference in the description of item

Please contact me within 3 days as a date following the delivery completion date of Yamato Transport on HP.

I will return the successful bid price, including shipping accept the returned goods in that case.

※ If you would older than the number of days specified, you will not be able to accept returned goods. Please note

Used Clock "Hayakawa" is responsible with respect to dealings

Please be assured we will respond.

Contact E-mail address: ttn5adk2at@mx2.ttcn.ne.jp

Website: http: //tootoo.to/user/naohikohayakawa/

The opening bid price is a reasonable 14,000 Yen. But I'm not sure where that figure of 81,000 comes from, or fits in. 

Unless that's the seller's reserve price - in which case, going by previous selling prices for this model, they're dreaming.

I've always been vociferously critical of profiteering eBay re-sellers. Apart from the 'Name and Shame' thread in the Members Lounge section, there are a number of individual topics in this forum section dedicated to various individuals documenting their eBay activities.

Then you've got the other 'smarter' re-sellers, who buy their watches on one sales platform and re-sell on another - e.g. eBay and Yahoo Japan (and visa versa for that matter). One particular individual, who has been at it for many many years is the Yahoo Japan re-seller Swotlab. He uses eBay ID mcn260 (which shows as either c***2 or 2***m in abbreviated / encrypted form) to bid on and buy his stock for immediate resale on YJ. Here are just a couple of his current listings:

A brown-coated 7A38-6020: http://page7.auctions.yahoo.co.jp/jp/auction/g145183173 - Bid 36,000 Yen or Buy-it-Now 43,000 Yen.

.... Bought by Swotlab on eBay (using his mcn260 ID): http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/301342384656 for US $168.05 on 13th October.

A black-dialed 7A48-5010: http://page7.auctions.yahoo.co.jp/jp/auction/g145037229 - Bid 30,000 Yen or Buy-it-Now 34,000 Yen.

.... Bought by Swotlab on eBay (using his mcn260 ID): http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/121452924090 for $107.70 on 12th October.

Much to my annoyance and disgust, lately another chancer has jumped on the eBay / Yahoo Japan profiteering re-seller bandwagon.

I've commented elsewhere in the forum, but to anybody who collects (or just watches) Seiko 7Axx's it probably hasn't gone un-noticed that erstwhile fanatical Australian 7Axx collector Stuart Lennard (ex-forum member 'ginny') a.k.a. eBay ID rubyginny has been down-sizing (or possibly dissolving) his rapidly acquired impressive collection - ironically a good portion of which he bought off Yahoo Japan.

About three weeks ago, he listed a batch of 8 7Axx's - a mixture of 7A28's, 7A38's and 7A48's. Some made good prices; others not so.

These included a NOS 7A28-710A (which came from Yahoo Japan) and Stuart's third NOS 7A38-7140 (which came from eBay Italy).

Both of which would be instantly recognisable to me (and others):

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/121452929371

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/121452920830

Both were won by the same buyer whose eBay ID shows as either 4***d (bidding) or n***4 (feedback) in abbreviated / encrypted form:

In less than a fortnight, both were listed on Yahoo Japan by this new (to me) would-be profiteering Japanese re-seller scum I_h_m_m:

See: http://page6.auctions.yahoo.co.jp/jp/auction/f145776219 and: http://page18.auctions.yahoo.co.jp/jp/auction/w113633756

A quick conversion: 128,000 Yen = approx. $1200 (as opposed to $650 paid) and 55,000 Yen = approx. $510 (compared to $317). 

This Japanese bidder eBay ID 4***d (23) has bid on most of Stuart's current batch of 11 eBay listings for 7A28's and 7A38's and is still currently high bidder on a couple of them, with approximately 8 hours before they're due to end. He needs to be de-railed somehow, to discourage him from dabbling in 7Axx's and prevent any chance of future repetition.

As things panned out, thankfully, our would-be profiteering Japanese re-seller only won two of Stuart's last batch of 11 eBay auctions for his 7Axx's (which ended in the early hours of Sunday morning 26th October).

These were the NOS brown-coated 7A38-6020 and a used two-tone 7A38-7060, which Stuart had mistakenly listed as a 7A28-7060.

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/121464189995

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/121464205623

Yesterday, this person (eBay user ID 4***d / n***4) left Stuart (rubyginny) feedback against both items:

So I knew it was just a matter of time before he listed them on Yahoo Japan auctions. Earlier today, bang on schedule they appeared:

http://page13.auctions.yahoo.co.jp/jp/auction/r120581060 and http://page5.auctions.yahoo.co.jp/jp/auction/e154235349

The inflated asking prices of this would-be profiteering re-seller's two latest listings: 98,000 and 24,800 Yen equate to approx. $855 and $216 (USD), compared to $590 and $160.50 respectively, which he paid Stuart for them on eBay, less than two weeks ago.

I suspect our would-be Japanese profiteering re-seller will be re-listing these ad nauseam at his inflated prices for months to come ....

Along with his two previous 7Axx eBay purchases from Stuart Lennard. 

This would-be profiteering Japanese Yahoo Japan re-seller l_h_m_m is laughably predictable. 

If you've read my updates of 10 days ago, to the Name and Shame thread in the Members Lounge section then ....

You'll know I'd identified the eBay ID he uses (which shows as n***4 / 4***d in abbreviated / encrypted form) - lonto4271_6h4dgvu

Towards the end of last week, he left Stuart Lennard (rubyginny) feedback against the only two 7Axx's he'd won from the last batch:

They were an average condition stainless 7A38-7020, which he paid rather too much for, in his efforts to win Stuart's auction:

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/121476496880

and a gold tone 7A28-6030 which he picked up relatively cheaply for only $66 due to lack of interest from other bidders:

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/121476490469

This morning, both were summarily listed on Yahoo Japan, to bring the tally of his unsold (ex-Stuart Lennard) 7Axx's to six:

http://sellinglist.auctions.yahoo.co.jp/user/l_h_m_m?p=7a

Despite his apparent enthusiasm for the Seiko 7Axx marque (or should I correctly say making a profit from re-selling them) ....

It would appear that this greedy incompetent is incapable of undertaking the most basic of repairs to justify any such mark-up. 

If you read and translate his own Yahoo Japan listing descriptions of the 7A38-7020 and 7A28-6030 ....

http://page6.auctions.yahoo.co.jp/jp/auction/f146828841 and http://page13.auctions.yahoo.co.jp/jp/auction/r12104245

He appears to have done nothing about sorting the sticky pushers on the former (which he commented on in the feedback he left).

.... Nor replacing the badly scratched crystal on the latter. Still, at least he appears capable of removing a strap, if nothing else. 

Speaking of eBay to Yahoo Japan would-be profiteering re-sellers, Japanese moon-phase fanciers may have noticed that established YJ re-seller Swotlab has just listed 6 various 7A48's on eBay (the bottom one is actually a re-listing of a previous existing listing):

http://sellinglist.auctions.yahoo.co.jp/user/swotlab?p=7a48

The others came straight from this eBay listing for a lot of 5, sold as a Buy-it-Now by Stuart Lennard (rubyginny) early last week.

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/121484734217

The assessment I made (on 17th November) about would-be profiteering YJ re-seller l_h_m_m appears to be holding true. 

It would appear that this greedy incompetent is incapable of undertaking the most basic of repairs to justify any such mark-up.

His 6 various over-priced 7Axx's that he bought from Stuart Lennard remain unsold and have been re-listed a good few times.

Seems he's trying a different tack with his newest listing, for a below average condition 7A38-7029 which appeared yesterday.

http://page6.auctions.yahoo.co.jp/jp/auction/f147686993 

セイコー 7A38-7029 フライトマスタースポーツ100【ジャンク】

Google translates his description as follows:

[Product name] SEIKO QUARTZ Chronograph SPORT 100 7A38-7029 junk

[Overview] 7A38 is Giugiaro model was also the base of the world's first multi-function analog quartz watch and to improve the 7A28 was released, equipped with day-date function models will be.

[Serial No.] 3N6017 (83年11月production)

[Size] (not including crown) W × about 38.5mm stainless steel case approximately 18cm belt length

[Waterproof] 100M waterproof without waterproof test.

[Drive] quartz chronograph December 2014 battery replacement already date will be in English / Spanish.

[Operation] overhaul does not. Junk reason, second hand chronograph does not work sometimes. There is also when operating. It does not operate, and standing a few seconds to reset, does not return to the position of the second hand at 12. However, to return to the original by pressing the button on the 4:00 position by pulling one stage the crown. Other functions are operating normally.

[Accessories] without.

[State] to dial-case belt there is a small scratch use. Although did not appear, in the photograph to the crystal, there are a number of flaws. ※ if you wish to replace the crystal later, it is possible ordered separately parts for a fee.

[Shipping] (¥ 1200 + shipping) delivery letter pack from outside the fixed form, Yu-Pack, courier, etc., is the various available.

[Other] no claim no return. Question please if you have any questions. ※ other I am too exhibited. Please have a look.

Without even checking the serial number, as soon as I saw his listing, I knew exactly where this 7A28-7029 came from. 

There were 3 (that I saw) in varying conditions listed on eBay in the States in November. This was by far the worst of them. 

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/381045512535

But if anyone doubts me, here's a photo of the case-back from that listing, showing the same serial number 3N6017:

and of course the winning bidder of that eBay auction was 4***d - a.k.a. lonto4271_6h4dgvu

http://offer.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewBids&item=381045512535

Hopefully he'll catch a cold on this one. Bloody well serves him right, I say. 

Actually what I wrote in my previous post wasn't strictly correct. 

His 6 various over-priced 7Axx's that he bought from Stuart Lennard remain unsold and have been re-listed a good few times.

I just ran a search on his current 7Axx listings: http://sellinglist.auctions.yahoo.co.jp/user/l_h_m_m?p=7A

Looks like he's starting to cave in already ! 

The ex-Stuart Lennard two-tone 7A38-7060, which he was previously asking a laughable 24,800 Yen as a Buy-it-Now for ....

Was most recently re-listed as a low-start auction: http://page5.auctions.yahoo.co.jp/jp/auction/e154235349 

Now that was an interesting Yahoo Japan auction to watch - for more reasons than one ! 

http://page5.auctions.yahoo.co.jp/jp/auction/e154235349

With 30 minutes remaining, bidding was still only @ 6250 Yen:

Someone placed a bid in the final 5 minutes, taking it to 6750 Yen ....

.... and in doing so, caused a 10 minute automatic extension ....

.... which was followed by another extension ....

Down to the final 5 minutes of that extension, bidding was up to 8750 Yen ....

But that's how it finally ended - sold for mere 8750 Yen after 39 bids placed by 12 different bidders.

At today's exchange rate, 8750 Yen equates to approx. $73.50 USD (or nearly £47 GBP).

To have even matched the $160.50 (without $42 shipping) price that he paid Stuart Lennard for it at the end of October ....

.... our would-be profiteering re-seller l_h_m_m needed his auction to make at least 19,000 Yen (at today's exchange rates). 

So a complete and utter FAIL. IMHO he got his just deserts - call it Poetic Justice, Karma, whatever. Made my day. LOL !! 

I've just watched another YJ auction by would-be profiteering re-seller l_h_m_m (a.k.a. eBay ID lonto4271_6h4dgvu) ending.

The listing for his ex-eBay 7A38-7029. It was interesting to see the automatic extension working again - if for no other reason.

http://page6.auctions.yahoo.co.jp/jp/auction/f147686993

30 minutes and again at 15 minutes before it was scheduted to end (at 2 minutes past) bidding was stalled @ 6000 Yen.

Someone placed a bid in the final 10 minutes ....

....  automatically extending the auction by 5 minutes (note finishing time now shows as 7 minutes past):

And again - finishing time now shows as 12 minutes past:

So it went on - now extended to 17 minutes past. 

Down to the final 5 minutes of the last 5 minute extension - now due to end 20 minutes later than originally scheduled.

And that's how it finally ended ....

Sold for 9250 Yen after 54 bids by 13 different bidders.

9250 Yen equates to $79.63 USD / 50.60 GBP so once again, compared to what he paid for it  - FAIL.  Strike #2