NZ dealer lists a mint(ish) 7A38-704A SAA021J on eBay

Where to post about Seiko 7A38s, photos, questions, whatever.
Post Reply
User avatar
Seiko7A38
Site Admin
Posts: 2671
Joined: Thu Jan 28, 2021 12:05 pm
Location: S.W. England
Contact:

NZ dealer lists a mint(ish) 7A38-704A SAA021J on eBay

Post by Seiko7A38 »

Perhaps it's my imagination, but lately it seems that barely a week passes, without another 7A38 appearing on eBay, listed by some dealer or greedy speculator, with a four-figure asking price. The latest, which popped up in a search result earlier this morning, is an almost mint 7A38-704A, listed by a New Zealand dealer, with an affinity for black. 👎

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Seiko-1984-C ... 4209873995

7A38-704A-DarkGrey+Orange-eBay-Nov2021-Listing.png
7A38-704A-DarkGrey+Orange-eBay-Nov2021-Listing.png (218.75 KiB) Viewed 7183 times
rsz_7a38-704a-darkgrey-orange-ebay-nov2021-3.jpg
rsz_7a38-704a-darkgrey-orange-ebay-nov2021-3.jpg (230.42 KiB) Viewed 7178 times
rsz_7a38-704a-darkgrey-orange-ebay-nov2021-4.jpg
rsz_7a38-704a-darkgrey-orange-ebay-nov2021-4.jpg (189.56 KiB) Viewed 7178 times
rsz_7a38-704a-darkgrey-orange-ebay-nov2021-5.jpg
rsz_7a38-704a-darkgrey-orange-ebay-nov2021-5.jpg (237.39 KiB) Viewed 7178 times
rsz_7a38-704a-darkgrey-orange-ebay-nov2021-6.jpg
rsz_7a38-704a-darkgrey-orange-ebay-nov2021-6.jpg (234.64 KiB) Viewed 7178 times
7A38-704A-DarkGrey+Orange-eBay-Nov2021-Description.png
7A38-704A-DarkGrey+Orange-eBay-Nov2021-Description.png (38.19 KiB) Viewed 7182 times

This is the same Wellington-based dealer, fivefortyfive.nz who sold a distinctly iffy 7A38-701B 'Vulcan' earlier this year.

Besides listing it on eBay with a risible Buy-it-Now price of $1245 (US), it's also on their website, asking $1565 (NZ).

https://fivefortyfive.nz/products/seiko ... 9662&_ss=r

7A38-704A-DarkGrey+Orange-fivefortyfive.nz.png
7A38-704A-DarkGrey+Orange-fivefortyfive.nz.png (134.6 KiB) Viewed 7181 times

It really begs the question why they persist in using such dark photographs on black backgrounds, both on eBay and their website, when their well lit first floor boutique store has three large picture windows to both front and rear elevations. Check out: FIVE:45 YouTube video and their Instagram page (where there are plenty of properly lit photos of watches). Perhaps they think it's 'arty', or maybe they're NZ rugby fans, subtly 'tipping a hat' to the All Blacks. I suspect it's more likely they're sometimes using such poorly lit photos to disguise any cosmetic defects in the watches offered for sale.

User avatar
Seiko7A38
Site Admin
Posts: 2671
Joined: Thu Jan 28, 2021 12:05 pm
Location: S.W. England
Contact:

Re: NZ dealer lists a mint(ish) 7A38-704A SAA021J on eBay

Post by Seiko7A38 »

Although one might not expect them to rock up in Antipodes, I've seen another similar condition example 7A38-704A SAA021J in New Zealand, comparatively recently - posted on Instagram, by blackwatchnz (Matt) in September 2020:

7A38-704A-DarkGrey+Orange-Instagram-blackwatchnz-1.jpg
7A38-704A-DarkGrey+Orange-Instagram-blackwatchnz-1.jpg (88.9 KiB) Viewed 7176 times
7A38-704A-DarkGrey+Orange-Instagram-blackwatchnz-2.jpg
7A38-704A-DarkGrey+Orange-Instagram-blackwatchnz-2.jpg (240.79 KiB) Viewed 7176 times
7A38-704A-DarkGrey+Orange-Instagram-blackwatchnz-WristShot.jpg
7A38-704A-DarkGrey+Orange-Instagram-blackwatchnz-WristShot.jpg (248.65 KiB) Viewed 7176 times

Matt subsequently sold it to Jarrod, who posted this wrist shot on Instagram as waikato7 in December 2020:

7A38-704A-DarkGrey+Orange-Instagram-waikato7-(Jarrod)-WristShot-THU24-(ex-blackwatchnz).jpg
7A38-704A-DarkGrey+Orange-Instagram-waikato7-(Jarrod)-WristShot-THU24-(ex-blackwatchnz).jpg (216.39 KiB) Viewed 7165 times

I've absolutely no way of proving this is the same watch listed by ninefortyfive.nz from their pitch black photos. :roll:

User avatar
Seiko7A38
Site Admin
Posts: 2671
Joined: Thu Jan 28, 2021 12:05 pm
Location: S.W. England
Contact:

Re: NZ dealer lists a mint(ish) 7A38-704A SAA021J on eBay

Post by Seiko7A38 »

One thing's certain: that it's not the same 7A38-704A SAA021J sold by Michele of Segnatempo in September this year:

7A38-704A-DarkGrey+Orange-FS-Segnatempo.it-Sept2021-1.jpg
7A38-704A-DarkGrey+Orange-FS-Segnatempo.it-Sept2021-1.jpg (101.26 KiB) Viewed 7162 times
7A38-704A-DarkGrey+Orange-FS-Segnatempo.it-Sept2021-4.jpg
7A38-704A-DarkGrey+Orange-FS-Segnatempo.it-Sept2021-4.jpg (65.7 KiB) Viewed 7162 times
7A38-704A-DarkGrey+Orange-FS-Segnatempo.it-Sept2021-5.jpg
7A38-704A-DarkGrey+Orange-FS-Segnatempo.it-Sept2021-5.jpg (88.31 KiB) Viewed 7162 times

Not only was that example in close to NOS condition, but it had a different serial number. Properly lit photos, too. ;)

User avatar
Seiko7A38
Site Admin
Posts: 2671
Joined: Thu Jan 28, 2021 12:05 pm
Location: S.W. England
Contact:

Re: NZ dealer lists a mint 7A38-704A SAA021J on eBay

Post by Seiko7A38 »

Seiko7A38 wrote: Sun Nov 07, 2021 11:22 amMatt subsequently sold it to Jarrod, who posted this wrist shot on Instagram as waikato7 in December 2020:

7A38-704A-DarkGrey+Orange-Instagram-waikato7-(Jarrod)-WristShot-THU24-(ex-blackwatchnz).jpg
7A38-704A-DarkGrey+Orange-Instagram-waikato7-(Jarrod)-WristShot-THU24-(ex-blackwatchnz).jpg (216.39 KiB) Viewed 7125 times

I've absolutely no way of proving this is the same watch listed by ninefortyfive.nz from their pitch black photos. :roll:
Seiko7A38 wrote: Sun Nov 07, 2021 9:47 am.... they're sometimes using such poorly lit photos to disguise any cosmetic defects in the watches offered for sale.
Ahem. Closer examination of ninefortyfive.nz's second conveniently softly focused, typically badly lit photo reveals what appears to an identical chip in the dark grey PVD coating @ 4 o'clock, on the edge of the (integral) 'bezel' rim.

rsz_7a38-704a-darkgrey-orange-ebay-nov2021-2.jpg
rsz_7a38-704a-darkgrey-orange-ebay-nov2021-2.jpg (217.25 KiB) Viewed 7127 times

User avatar
Seiko7A38
Site Admin
Posts: 2671
Joined: Thu Jan 28, 2021 12:05 pm
Location: S.W. England
Contact:

Re: NZ dealer lists a mint(ish) 7A38-704A SAA021J on eBay

Post by Seiko7A38 »

Not that they really add anything, but these low quality grainy photos are of the same 7A38-704A, from when it first appeared on eBay in July 2020. The second photo shows a similar chip in the pvd coating on the bezel rim @ 4 o'clock.

7A38-704A-DarkGrey+Orange-eBay-July2020-Another-1.jpg
7A38-704A-DarkGrey+Orange-eBay-July2020-Another-1.jpg (155.18 KiB) Viewed 7111 times
7A38-704A-DarkGrey+Orange-eBay-July2020-Another-2.jpg
7A38-704A-DarkGrey+Orange-eBay-July2020-Another-2.jpg (96.49 KiB) Viewed 7111 times
7A38-704A-DarkGrey+Orange-eBay-July2020-Another-3.jpg
7A38-704A-DarkGrey+Orange-eBay-July2020-Another-3.jpg (92.88 KiB) Viewed 7111 times
7A38-704A-DarkGrey+Orange-eBay-July2020-Another-4.jpg
7A38-704A-DarkGrey+Orange-eBay-July2020-Another-4.jpg (79.42 KiB) Viewed 7111 times

By some fluke, I managed to find a reference to it in my email inbox (I'd asked the seller a question):

7A38-704A-DarkGrey+Orange-eBay-July2020-Listing-Summary.png
7A38-704A-DarkGrey+Orange-eBay-July2020-Listing-Summary.png (70.58 KiB) Viewed 7100 times

Edit: the Italian eBay seller bimba-59 (who incidentally is no longer a registered user) re-listed it later that month, with a Buy-it-Now price increased to a typically ludicrous 1500 Euros and these 4 small photos which add absolutely nothing !

7A38-704A-DarkGrey+Orange-eBay-July2020-Re-Listing-Notification.png
7A38-704A-DarkGrey+Orange-eBay-July2020-Re-Listing-Notification.png (62.52 KiB) Viewed 7098 times
7A38-704A-DarkGrey+Orange-eBay-July2020-Another-(Re-listed)-RevisedPhotos-1.jpg
7A38-704A-DarkGrey+Orange-eBay-July2020-Another-(Re-listed)-RevisedPhotos-1.jpg (19.04 KiB) Viewed 7104 times
7A38-704A-DarkGrey+Orange-eBay-July2020-Another-(Re-listed)-RevisedPhotos-2.jpg
7A38-704A-DarkGrey+Orange-eBay-July2020-Another-(Re-listed)-RevisedPhotos-2.jpg (15.33 KiB) Viewed 7104 times
7A38-704A-DarkGrey+Orange-eBay-July2020-Another-(Re-listed)-RevisedPhotos-3.jpg
7A38-704A-DarkGrey+Orange-eBay-July2020-Another-(Re-listed)-RevisedPhotos-3.jpg (13.03 KiB) Viewed 7104 times
7A38-704A-DarkGrey+Orange-eBay-July2020-Another-(Re-listed)-RevisedPhotos-4.jpg
7A38-704A-DarkGrey+Orange-eBay-July2020-Another-(Re-listed)-RevisedPhotos-4.jpg (14.79 KiB) Viewed 7104 times

User avatar
Seiko7A38
Site Admin
Posts: 2671
Joined: Thu Jan 28, 2021 12:05 pm
Location: S.W. England
Contact:

Re: NZ dealer lists a mint(ish) 7A38-704A SAA021J on eBay

Post by Seiko7A38 »

Perhaps I could have been more discreet in the wording I chose to start this thread, but I stand by my earlier criticism of NZ dealer Five:45 (fivefortyfive.nz) for their dark photographs and over-ambitious pricing. I deliberately delayed adding anything more to this thread, to allow for the time difference: New Zealand is +13 hours ahead of GMT.

Yesterday afternoon, In an effort to get to the bottom of this, I sent DM's to both Instagram posters: blackwatchnz (Matt) and waikato7 (Jarrod). Both have kindly replied overnight. Although the timing (August 2020) was about right, my assumption that Matt had bought the 7A38-704A from the Italian eBay seller bimba-59 was incorrect. Transpires he bought it from another NZ collector in September 2020 and had no knowledge of its history prior to that. He disclosed the price that he paid, which was considerably less than the Italian seller's ludicrous Buy-it-Now price of 1500 Euros.

In an unexpected twist, Jarrod still owns the 7A38-704A. Dealer fivefortyfive.nz is selling it for him on commission. Both he and Matt are friends with the store owners through the watch collector enthusiast group redbarnz. Indeed, Jarrod appears to run it, per the email link on their Instagram page.

Redbarnz-Instagram-Profile.png
Redbarnz-Instagram-Profile.png (37.84 KiB) Viewed 7055 times

User avatar
Seiko7A38
Site Admin
Posts: 2671
Joined: Thu Jan 28, 2021 12:05 pm
Location: S.W. England
Contact:

Re: NZ dealer lists a mint(ish) 7A38-704A SAA021J on eBay

Post by Seiko7A38 »

However, all parties involved appear to have got caught up in the vicious price hiking spiral that afflicts Seiko 7A38's.

Over the last decade, the majority of NOS condition 7A38-704A SAA021J's have turned up on eBay Italy (along with dozens of 7A38-7140 SAA051J's, 7A38-6020 SAA043J's and other 7Axx models). As I've posited before, I believe this was due to Seiko having off-loaded excess unsold inventory of less popular variants on their Italian distributor Italwatch.

Historically, Italian eBay sellers have frequently tried demanding ludicrous prices, often incorrectly attributing them to 'Giugiaro'. Indeed, the watch that kicked off the old forum's Craziest Ebay Prices thread was a NOS 7A38-704A SAA021J, listed at the end of January 2012 by an Italian eBay seller with a typically extortionate Buy-it-Now price of $2350 !! :o (From memory, it eventually sold for $800).

However, just because a good many turn up on eBay Italy, that isn't necessarily where they were originally exported to. Thanks to a thread started by another poster, samulis, in the old forum's Other Watch Forum's Sales Corner section, I'm able to reveal some earlier sales history of this particular 7A38-704A: NOS 7A38-704A FS on Chronocentric.com

7A38-704A-SAA021J-FS-Chronocentric-April2016-samulis-Post.jpg
7A38-704A-SAA021J-FS-Chronocentric-April2016-samulis-Post.jpg (215.06 KiB) Viewed 7004 times

The same watch (note the same style Seiko presentation box and hang tag in the two embedded photos) was advertised for sale by a Belgian seller on Chronocentric.com in April 2016 asking 450 Euros. The link to the FS advert still works.

7A38-704A-NOS-FS-Chronocentric.com-April2016-Post.png
7A38-704A-NOS-FS-Chronocentric.com-April2016-Post.png (222.21 KiB) Viewed 6998 times

Member samulis ended the thread with another post, advising that the watch was also offered for sale on WatchUseek:

7A38-704A-NOS-FS-WatchUseek-April2016-Post.png
7A38-704A-NOS-FS-WatchUseek-April2016-Post.png (12.87 KiB) Viewed 6994 times

Indeed the link to the (sold) WatchUseek FS thread, posted 3 days later, with the price reduced to €399 still also works.

7A38-704A-Grey+Orange-NOS-FS-WatchUseek-April2016-septentrio-Post.png
7A38-704A-Grey+Orange-NOS-FS-WatchUseek-April2016-septentrio-Post.png (132.93 KiB) Viewed 6993 times

Unfortunately the photos embedded in both FS adverts have long since disappeared, but luckily I habitually saved them.

7A38-704A-Grey+Orange-NOS-FS-Chronocentric.com-April2016-1.jpg
7A38-704A-Grey+Orange-NOS-FS-Chronocentric.com-April2016-1.jpg (173.29 KiB) Viewed 6986 times
rsz_7a38-704a-grey-orange-nos-fs-chronocentriccom-april2016-2.jpg
rsz_7a38-704a-grey-orange-nos-fs-chronocentriccom-april2016-2.jpg (243.73 KiB) Viewed 6985 times
7A38-704A-Grey+Orange-NOS-FS-Chronocentric.com-April2016-3.jpg
7A38-704A-Grey+Orange-NOS-FS-Chronocentric.com-April2016-3.jpg (95.45 KiB) Viewed 6986 times
7A38-704A-Grey+Orange-NOS-FS-Chronocentric.com-April2016-4.jpg
7A38-704A-Grey+Orange-NOS-FS-Chronocentric.com-April2016-4.jpg (174.84 KiB) Viewed 6986 times
7A38-704A-Grey+Orange-NOS-FS-Chronocentric.com-April2016-5.jpg
7A38-704A-Grey+Orange-NOS-FS-Chronocentric.com-April2016-5.jpg (186.27 KiB) Viewed 6986 times
7A38-704A-Grey+Orange-NOS-FS-Chronocentric.com-April2016-6.jpg
7A38-704A-Grey+Orange-NOS-FS-Chronocentric.com-April2016-6.jpg (231.95 KiB) Viewed 6986 times
7A38-704A-Grey+Orange-NOS-FS-Chronocentric.com-April2016-7.jpg
7A38-704A-Grey+Orange-NOS-FS-Chronocentric.com-April2016-7.jpg (122.61 KiB) Viewed 6986 times
Seiko7A38 wrote: Sun Nov 07, 2021 2:32 pmNot that they really add anything, but these low quality grainy photos are of the same 7A38-704A, from when it first appeared on eBay in July 2020. The second photo shows a similar chip in the pvd coating on the bezel rim @ 4 o'clock.
What I hadn't realized before was that when the Italian eBay seller first listed it in July 2020 (as an auction, with an opening bid price of 790 Euros), he'd 'borrowed' 3 of the Belgian seller's photos ! In doing so, some resolution was lost (hence my comment about 'low quality grainy photos'). Although similar file sizes, the Belgian seller's original images were sharper and, if you zoom in on the fifth photo, it's just possible to discern the case-back serial number: 459204, proving conclusively that it's the same watch. 8-)

User avatar
Seiko7A38
Site Admin
Posts: 2671
Joined: Thu Jan 28, 2021 12:05 pm
Location: S.W. England
Contact:

Re: NZ dealer lists a mint(ish) 7A38-704A SAA021J on eBay

Post by Seiko7A38 »

O.K., so I will admit to having sent Kiwi eBay seller fivefortyfive.nz a sarcastically worded message about their deliberately dark photos. I really didn't expect them to reply. But kudos to them (rather than Kia Ora) they did.

7A38-704A-DarkGrey+Orange-eBay-Nov2021-(Re-seller)-Message-Reply.png
7A38-704A-DarkGrey+Orange-eBay-Nov2021-(Re-seller)-Message-Reply.png (120.87 KiB) Viewed 6916 times

Note the phrase: '.... our style of photography is stylized'. :roll: (As I hinted earlier: Perhaps they think it's 'arty'). :lol:

Over-ambitious pricing apart, for anybody who might be interested, here's those 5 additional photos, taken in broad daylight, which show the nicks in the watch case's pvd coating near 4 o'clock and the other one on the left hand side:

7A38-704A-DarkGrey+Orange-eBay-Nov2021-(Re-seller)-Additional-1.jpg
7A38-704A-DarkGrey+Orange-eBay-Nov2021-(Re-seller)-Additional-1.jpg (190.57 KiB) Viewed 6911 times
7A38-704A-DarkGrey+Orange-eBay-Nov2021-(Re-seller)-Additional-2.jpg
7A38-704A-DarkGrey+Orange-eBay-Nov2021-(Re-seller)-Additional-2.jpg (177.82 KiB) Viewed 6911 times
7A38-704A-DarkGrey+Orange-eBay-Nov2021-(Re-seller)-Additional-3.jpg
7A38-704A-DarkGrey+Orange-eBay-Nov2021-(Re-seller)-Additional-3.jpg (180.16 KiB) Viewed 6911 times
7A38-704A-DarkGrey+Orange-eBay-Nov2021-(Re-seller)-Additional-4.jpg
7A38-704A-DarkGrey+Orange-eBay-Nov2021-(Re-seller)-Additional-4.jpg (155.24 KiB) Viewed 6911 times
7A38-704A-DarkGrey+Orange-eBay-Nov2021-(Re-seller)-Additional-5.jpg
7A38-704A-DarkGrey+Orange-eBay-Nov2021-(Re-seller)-Additional-5.jpg (201.88 KiB) Viewed 6911 times

User avatar
Seiko7A38
Site Admin
Posts: 2671
Joined: Thu Jan 28, 2021 12:05 pm
Location: S.W. England
Contact:

Re: NZ dealer lists a mint(ish) 7A38-704A SAA021J on eBay

Post by Seiko7A38 »

It may have taken more than 7 months, but it looks like Kiwi dealer fivefortyfive.nz has eventually found a buyer for Jarrod's 7A38-704A. Checking my eBay watching page I noticed they'd ended their listing as item no longer available.

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/334209873995

7A38-704A-DarkGrey+Orange-eBay-Nov2021-Ended-NLA.png
7A38-704A-DarkGrey+Orange-eBay-Nov2021-Ended-NLA.png (41.09 KiB) Viewed 5911 times
Seiko7A38 wrote: Sun Nov 07, 2021 9:47 amBesides listing it on eBay with a risible Buy-it-Now price of $1245 (US), it's also on their website, asking $1565 (NZ).

https://fivefortyfive.nz/products/seiko ... 9662&_ss=r
Checking their website shows it 'Sold Out', but that the price had subsequently been changed from $1565 (NZ) to $1220.

7A38-704A-DarkGrey+Orange-fivefortyfive.nz-SoldOut.jpg
7A38-704A-DarkGrey+Orange-fivefortyfive.nz-SoldOut.jpg (112.31 KiB) Viewed 5915 times

Post Reply