Seiko 7A38 - by the numbers

The 7A28-7090 Yacht Timer, Seiko sales code SAY080 was a JDM market model, so naturally the best place to search for one is on Yahoo Japan auctions. They've always been popular with collectors, but have become increasingly more so in recent years thanks to Fratello Watches and other blogs promoting them as 'cool' and hence desirable. Though it's not a proper 'count down' yacht timer as used in regattas - just a bog standard 7A28 with the 30 minute sub-dial printed in blue 5-minute segments to look like one. It's not unusual to see asking prices in excess of 100,000 Yen and exceptional examples sometimes sell for considerably more. Here's a closed search result on recently ended Yahoo Japan auctions:


The watch originally came fitted with a rubber strap: Seiko p/n GL21A. This was also used on its rarer black chromed sibling, the Bridgestone Motorsport branded 7A28-7140 (fitted with a black buckle) and also the H556-5100 'Pre-Arnie'. Original rubber straps will have perished after 35 years, even if well cared for. If they are still intact, wearing one is likely to end in tears. Here's a plaintif WTB advert on Omega forums posted by a concerned owner a few years ago. The poster subsequently sold it 9 months later (thanks to the Fratello article), fitted with a blue Eulit Perlon 2-piece strap.

Nobody seems interested in manufacturing a reproduction of the GL21A, which is why the majority of examples of the 7A28-7090 that come up for sale, will have some other strap fitted: maybe some other pattern 'Dive' strap; occasionally leather, but most commonly a royal blue NATO. Some sellers don't even bother and just list them as 'head only's.

As indeed are the two examples currently listed on Yahoo Japan:


It was the first one that caught my attention.

Four weekends ago (May 16th) I was deep in DM conversation with forum member Guy J on Instagram. Out of the blue, he wrote: 'Did you see the beater 7A28-7090?' I replied I hadn't. He sent me a Buyee link to a Yahoo Japan listing, and followed up with 'No takers at £680 (before it soon adds up if acquired at that price)'. It was a 'head only', significantly missing the 2 o'clock pusher button, with what appeared to be moisture damage / micro-blistering on the dial. At the time we looked at the listing, there definitely wasn't a photo of the movement included. Guy wrote again: 'Issue is, I wonder just how much rust there is at the 2 o'clock pusher. And if that dirt on the dual is superficial. Hesitant to spend that even on a nice one...but I do like a mystery project.' My reply was: 'That's 100K Yen (£680) Guy. Crazy money.'

Well the 'mystery' is well and truly over !! Evidently the Japanese seller later managed to unscrew the case-back.

The YJ seller appears to have edited the original listing and re-listed it twice. Hardly surprising, given the 100,000 Yen asking price, it steadfastly remained unsold at the end of May:

https://page.auctions.yahoo.co.jp/jp/auction/e514655571


Here's a Google translation of the Japanese seller's (later revised) description:


This morning, I ran one of my random searches on '7A28' on Yahoo Japan and spotted what was obviously the same 'head only' 7A28-7090 Yacht Timer (recognisable by its missing pusher button). It had been re-listed earlier this week (with a new YJ item number) as a 6-day auction, with an opening bid price of 'only' 10,000 yen. Bidding is currently stalled @ 21,000 Yen with two days still remaining.

https://page.auctions.yahoo.co.jp/jp/auction/s824613077


The question is - how brave (or reckless) are you feeling ??

This post more properly belongs in the eBay section, but as I didn't particularly want to start another separate thread about 7A28-7090 Yacht Timer asking prices, I'm going to tack it onto this one. It's connected in a way as you'll see ....

Seiko7A38 wrote: ↑Sun Jun 13, 2021 1:49 pmThe 7A28-7090 Yacht Timer, Seiko sales code SAY080 was a JDM market model, so naturally the best place to search for one is on Yahoo Japan auctions. They've always been popular with collectors, but have become increasingly more so in recent years thanks to Fratello Watches and other blogs promoting them as 'cool' and hence desirable.

There is another factor that's contributed to their increased prices over the last few years and that's speculators, or as I tend to refer to them as profiteering re-sellers. There are a number of Japanese cross-platform sellers, notably the loathsome jap_t_t_y and japan_pre-owned_vintage who deliberately buy up more desirable 7Axx's off Yahoo Japan to re-sell for double the price on eBay. Yesterday evening, out of curiosity, I ran a worldwide eBay search on 7A28-7090, to see if there were currently any being listed by Japanese cross-platform re-sellers. There weren't. But there is this one, which has been listed by a US eBay seller rtm127, since March with an outrageous Buy-it-Now price of $2500 !!

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/RARE-1983-Ma ... 3430105126

Seiko7A38 wrote: ↑Sun Jun 13, 2021 1:49 pm.... which is why the majority of examples of the 7A28-7090 that come up for sale, will have some other strap fitted: maybe some other pattern 'Dive' strap ....

Some rubber 'Dive' strap patterns are shall we say more 'distinctive' (hence easily recognisable) than others.

Remember this from my first post ?

Seiko7A38 wrote: ↑Sun Jun 13, 2021 1:49 pmIt's not unusual to see asking prices in excess of 100,000 Yen and exceptional examples sometimes sell for considerably more. Here's a closed search result on recently ended Yahoo Japan auctions:

Among those was this example, fitted with an unusual rubber 'Dive' strap, which sold on Yahoo Japan in February for 113,000 Yen after 26 bids, plus 10% Japanese Sales Tax, totalling 124,300 Yen, then equivalent to approx. $1175 USD.


Here's the equivalent number of the original Japanese seller's photos:


Needless to say, the unusual rubber 'Dive' strap, the small chip in the edge of the crystal @ '30' and the case-back serial number 351241 all match. However, comparing his eBay listing photos of the watch with the original Japanese seller's, it would appear that the dial has 'mysteriously' suffered some degradation - pointing to the dial / movement having been swapped for another. The other glaring difference is obviously in the prices: $1175 (Yen equivalent) purchase vs $2500 asking - more than double ! What amazes me is that since he listed this grossly over-priced example on eBay, it's managed to amass over 50 watchers; the listing having received nearly 4700 views in the last 3 months !

The re-listed 6-day Yahoo Japan auction for that rusted-out 7A28-7090 Yacht Timer 'head only' ended a few minutes ago, selling for ¥45,500 Yen after 13 bids (unlucky for somebody), equivalent to approx. $413.25 USD / £293.70 GBP.
I'm sure whoever bought it is capable of swapping the dial and hands onto a 7A28 donor movement (or knows somebody who can), but where are they going to find the missing pusher button (Seiko p/n 80600769) ? Then there's that moisture damaged dial. The mind boggles.

https://page.auctions.yahoo.co.jp/jp/auction/s824613077

Last week, out of curiosity, I'd added another Yahoo Japan listing for a 7A28-7090 Yacht Timer 'head only' to my Buyee watching page. It was a 7-day auction, by a 'Store' seller (thus subject to 10% Japanese Sales Tax), with an opening bid price of 910 Yen. I'd forgotten about it, but fortunately managed to catch it, 2 minutes before it was coming to an end.

https://page.auctions.yahoo.co.jp/jp/auction/q458763899


Adding the 10% Tax, it sold for a hefty 192,500 Yen after 47 bids, equivalent to approx. $1747.50 USD / £1256.00 GBP.


The other 'head only' auction listing that I'd mentioned briefly in my first post sold for 182,000 Yen a couple of days ago.
So perhaps 45,500 Yen for that rusted-out example, minus pusher button, was a bargain after all. Or maybe not !

Seiko7A38 wrote: ↑Mon Jun 14, 2021 9:17 am This post more properly belongs in the eBay section, but as I didn't particularly want to start another separate thread about 7A28-7090 Yacht Timer asking prices, I'm going to tack it onto this one. It's connected in a way as you'll see ....

There is another factor that's contributed to their increased prices over the last few years and that's speculators, or as I tend to refer to them as profiteering re-sellers. There are a number of Japanese cross-platform sellers, notably the loathsome jap_t_t_y and japan_pre-owned_vintage who deliberately buy up more desirable 7Axx's off Yahoo Japan to re-sell for double the price on eBay. Yesterday evening, out of curiosity, I ran a worldwide eBay search on 7A28-7090, to see if there were currently any being listed by Japanese cross-platform re-sellers. There weren't. But there is this one, which has been listed by a US eBay seller rtm127, since March with an outrageous Buy-it-Now price of $2500 !!

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/RARE-1983-Ma ... 3430105126

With hindsight, I probably should have started a new thread in the eBay section. But for now, as I've already posted about profiteering US eBay re-seller rtm127 in this thread, I'll carry on here. His previous ridiculously over-priced ex-Yahoo Japan 7A28-7090 Yacht Timer still remains unsold. At the weekend, he listed two more (one on a NATO; another on a correct Seiko GL21A rubber strap) with even more outrageous asking prices of $3400 and $3900 respectively !!
Here's a link to the summary below.


Needless to say, both his latest grossly over-priced 7A28-7090 Yacht Timers were sourced from Yahoo Japan auctions, where he purchased them for considerably lower prices - coincidentally both as 'head only's. Indeed, both YJ auction results are conveniently captured in the screen-shot summary in my previous post. The one fitted with a blue striped NATO is the 'head only' which sold on Yahoo Japan on 19th June for 182,000 Yen. The other one that he's since fitted with an original Seiko GL21A rubber strap sold two days later, on Yahoo Japan for 192,500 Yen on 21st June. Of course, I checked, and it goes without saying, that their case-back serial numbers: 350849 and 351279 respectively both match. I'll let you do the math, but even allowing $250 for the GL21A strap, both are now marked up by more than double.