Junghans 24/4610 High Tech Chrono - Rückwärts Nicht Technik

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Junghans 24/4610 High Tech Chrono - Rückwärts Nicht Technik

Post by Seiko7A38 »

The Junghans 24/4610 High Tech Chrono is, to the best of my knowledge, the only re-branded 'Seiko 7A38' produced by a German manufacturer. It uses a generic unbranded version of the movement, (save for V906A printed on the battery positive plate), similar to the C.G.H. Shimauchi Ltd. V906 (used in Yema N8, etc.) and Cartier Ferrari Formula Cal.531, but fitted with an English / German (EG) day star wheel.

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Other than the movement, the watch appears to be comprised of Junghans proprietary components. The watch case measures approx. 39mm diameter and a 19mm wide bracelet, with hidden butterfly clasp, is attached to a 14mm lug width fitting. The watch is coated in a silver anodized finish, with a gold plated (brass) decorative bezel ring. Other than that, only the crown is gold plated. The pushers are of the screw-in splined type, with double O-ring seals. The watch case construction employs plastic gaskets, giving it a questionable claimed water resistance of 50 metres.

Being a slightly quirky design in two-tone finish, they're something of an acquired taste and despite coming from a once hallowed German watch manufacturer, not a particularly popular choice among collectors of non-Seiko branded 7A38s. I've never been averse to two-tones myself and quite like them, personally. Here's an old wrist shot of one of mine, that I posted on the first page of the old forum's WRUW thread.

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Thing is, other than posting the odd wrist shot and criticising one particular deceptively described example (fitted with a non-original bracelet) in the 'Wrong Un's thread, I can't remember writing very much about them on the old forum. My omission, which I intend to rectify here, is probably due the fact, that prior to starting the Webs forum in January 2012, I'd already written about them, at some length, in a thread on the UK RLT watch forum towards the end of 2011, here:
Junghans High Tech - Yet Another Non-Seiko 7A38

Unfortunately, due to the manner of my departure from RLT, virtually all the embedded (PhotoBucket hosted) images have been removed from my posts. :x That said, there's still a wealth of information in the text, for anyone interested. I also included a short potted history of Junghans Uhren GmbH. Here are a couple of pertinent quotes from that post:
Back in the 1990's and early 2000's Junghans entered into 'master joint development agreements' with Seiko Epson Corp. These agreements covered the joint development of Junghans 'Mega' range of radio-controlled and solar-powered watches. It would seem from Junghans' use of Seiko 7A38 movements in their 'High Tech Chrono', there was also earlier collaboration.
Bearing in mind that Junghans were developing their Mega 1 (the World's first radio-controlled watch) at the time, I still can't fathom what could possibly have possessed their marketing department to call this watch the HIGH TECH chrono. It's a complete misnomer and utter travesty ! :roll: These watches were presumably manufactured in late 1987 or 1988, when Seiko had already been producing their own 7A38's for nearly 5 years. Hence my deliberately facetious title suffix: Rückwärts Nicht Technik. If the movements had been supplied to Junghans as part of any fledgling technology sharing agreement, I'd opine that they got the short end of the stick ! :lol:

That said, it seems to have been a fairly short-lived arrangement. I was browsing Junghans archives, to learn whether there might possibly have been another dial colour variant (there wasn't). I found the illustration below on page 17 of their 1989 catalogue. Please excuse the quality, but their .pdf scans are fairly low resolution. The smaller image of the watch in the 1988 catalogue is even poorer quality. If you view the full page scan of the 1989 catalogue, you'll see that on the same page there are also 3 versions of a rather more attractive-looking Junghans quartz chronograph, powered by the Citizen Cal. 3530 movement: 024/3805.44, 024/3806.44 and 024/3807.44. They're still shown as available in the 1990 catalogue, since joined by another Citizen 3510 powered chronograph (with alarm and date), model 024/3900.00. But no sign of the unloved 24/4610 High Tech Chrono, by then consigned to the pages of history. :cry:

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Note that the full catalogue number is 024/4610.44 (that '44' suffix was what made me wonder whether there might be another variant) - same as printed on the paper hang tag in a current eBay listing in a subsequent post. That also shows a retail price of 990 DM (equivalent to approx. 500 Euros). Whereas the watch's case-backs are only stamped 24/4610.

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Note that there is no manufacturing serial number - so no means of telling how many were produced. The case-back is a press fit (from memory, the only 7A38 not to have a screw-down threaded case-back) - hence the flat at the bottom, to facilitate insertion of a blade for removal. The case-back is sealed and retained using a hard red plastic (Sanfil) gasket similar to these offered by Cousins UK - visible in my first photo in this post.

Harking back to that old thread on the RLT forum and paraphrasing my first post ....

I found the first one I clapped eyes on, purely by accident. At the time, I still fancied a Junghans Max Bill Chronoscope and was idly googling images, when I came across this then long since ended US online auction, by Reata Pass Auctions, dating back to May 2007. The auctioneer's estimate was an over-optimistic $350 - $650. It only made $100 in the sale. I'm surprised that the link still worked after all this time. (Edit: it doesn't anymore). :(

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These are a couple of small screenshots I took of the only available parts information, on Boley.de, about 10 years ago:

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They've since changed the format of their database / search slightly, but it can still be found here.

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There's no part number for the gold-plated bezel ornament ring, nor a spare bracelet link, which are the parts you're most likely to need for any refurbishment. Whether Boley actually have the parts they list in stock is another question.

Other useful information can still be found in that old RLT thread, for example a suitable replacement generic crystal.
It was 30.4mm x 1.6mm thick, with no beveled edge. So I ordered a Sternkreuz MSM304 as a replacement.
It's almost identical, apart from being 0.1mm thinner, and indistinguishable from the original crystal when fitted.
A word to the wise (speaking from experience) ....
When replacing a crystal (I've done so in a couple of mine), ensure to check the condition of the retaining gasket ! :!:

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The white plastic ones used by Junghans appear to be of an inferior quality and deteriorate over time, becoming brittle and prone to cracking. That's the worst one I've encountered, but I had another which still looked fresh, but broke into two halves when I pressed the old crystal out. I've used both Sternkreuz and Superparts Hytrel gaskets as replacements. Worst case scenario: a damaged gasket will allow water ingress, leading to ruined Tachymeter ring printing, like this:

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Incidentally the threaded part of the crown stem is 0.9mm (Tap 10) the same as the Yema / C.G.H. Shimauchi V906; The standard Seiko 7A38 stem (p/n 0354728) thread is 0.8mm (Tap 11) by comparison.
The crown is sealed with a green plastic gasket, rather than an O-ring, adding to the already dubious water resistance:

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The links are 19mm wide by 6.5mm deep and removable ones are held together by the usual 1.0mm split pins.
Meaning that if you're planning to work on one, you'd be wise to invest a quid (£1) in a pack of Cousins p/n P20857P. ;)

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As also shown in a couple of my previous photos, the bracelet is attached to the case using 1.4mm Ø pins and tubes:

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This is a similar fixing arrangement to that used by the Yema Spationaute III and N8 Flygraf. However, the Junghans case has much narrower, shorter, more sharply tapering lugs, which makes it extremely difficult to press (or hammer) out the pins, without accidentally marking the lugs. The way I've gotten around it, when either cleaning or working on a 24/4610, is to leave both halves of the bracelet attached to the case, but shorten it, by pushing out the two 1.0mm Ø split pins nearest the case, thereby removing the adjustment links and butterfly clasp, which makes it less unwieldy.

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Re: Junghans 24/4610 High Tech Chrono - My little collection

Post by Seiko7A38 »

My little collection of them (4 so far). Left to right, in the order I acquired them, first 3 in 2011 and far right in 2018. The best condition example is third from left, which started out as a 'freebee' empty case and bracelet (see below). :)

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Checking my records, I've paid less than 100 Euros each for any of them (between 46 and 94 Euros), albeit the majority were acquired nearly 10 years ago in 2011. Probably the best 'bargain buy' was the example I bought from German eBay seller bergjodler58 in November 2011, for 52.99 Euros. To my surprise, along with the watch, the seller generously included an almost mint / complete spare watch case and bracelet - gratis, as a Christmas present, which came with a handwritten note (that I've kept to this day). In an amusing coincidence, the seller (Klaus) lived only 3 kilometres from the Junghans watch factory in Schramberg. The full story (less photos) is towards the bottom of that old RLT thread.

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From the various examples I've purchased and others seen listed on eBay Germany over the years, I've observed a couple of subtle manufacturing differences. Principally that Junghans used 3 different black painted sweep second hands. One looks like Seiko p/n 13SC06LC / 3AX130FOALB, but without the lumed arrowhead inlay and another like p/n 13SC04AB. The weight of the dial logo printing can vary noticeably, which may simply be due the tampo process. On some dials, the tiny lume pips at the ends of the hour batons have been omitted.

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The one on the right is the first example I ever bought, in too much haste, back in October 2011. It had obviously been messed with, from the black day wheel (which has long since been rectified). It appears to be fitted with a non-original crown, which actually works better than the standard part. I'd also secretly held doubts about the correctness of the sweep second hand, which seems slightly too long, yet perversely has a short tail. I've since seen a couple of others fitted with the same hand - as per the one that's been re-listed on eBay Germany since February, in my post below.

I haven't had any success finding pukka related accessories for them, in terms of the correct original presentation box, hang tag or even a Junghans user instruction manual (of more anon), other than these 3 plastic display stands that I bought for less than 10 Euros, back in January 2014 (German eBay seller's photo).

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Re: Junghans 24/4610 High Tech Chrono - F/S on Reddit

Post by Seiko7A38 »

Here's a typical used example, in average worn condition (with unfortunately a rather short bracelet) which that been re-listed on Reddit Watch Exchange by Romanian forum member 'gogusrl' (Andrei) since at least* October last year.

https://www.reddit.com/r/Watchexchange/ ... 38_inside/

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More photos in Andrei's Imgur album here. *Note the original upload date - 16th August 2020.

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I remember asking Andrei where he'd acquired it, a while back. I hadn't seen that one advertised anywhere. Naturally, he replied eBay Germany, which is where these usually turn up. In fact there are currently three listed on there ....

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Re: Junghans 24/4610 High Tech Chrono on eBay Germany #1

Post by Seiko7A38 »

This average condition example has been re-listed by the German eBay seller, ad nauseam since 7th February this year. Like his subsequent re-listings, it was a 7-day auction, originally with a highly over-optimistic opening bid price of 299 Euros, initially with the absolutely ludicrous option to Buy-it-Now for 450 Euros ! :lol:

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Junghans-Hig ... 4343345861

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This search result on WatchCount.com displays just a few of the more recent ended unsold re-listings:

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There have been at least another half a dozen more besides those, prior to that. Trust me. ;)
The current re-listed 7-day auction still has 3 days to run and still no sign of any interest yet.

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/224431512131

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Re: Junghans 24/4610 High Tech Chrono on eBay Germany #2

Post by Seiko7A38 »

This almost NOS condition example, complete with box, manual and hang tag, was listed nearly 3 weeks ago - 7th April. The German seller's asking price is 295 Euros, which almost looks a relative bargain, compared to the previous example.

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Herren-Armba ... 4723613513

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Re: Junghans 24/4610 High Tech Chrono on eBay Germany #3

Post by Seiko7A38 »

This average worn condition example, with user manual and warranty booklet, was listed yesterday evening, as a 5-day auction with an opening bid price of only 1 Euro. It's suffering from the common malady of manky hands lume (caused by poor case sealing, allowing moisture ingress) and has to be said, looks like it's in need of a damned good clean.

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Junghans-Hig ... 3373001472

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Unfortunately, one of the 'benefits' of Brexit, is that German eBay sellers now seem even more reluctant to deal with UK, than they were before we left the EU. :roll: Both this (and the previous) German seller are blocking bids from UK ! :x I would have relished the opportunity to bid on this one, to get my hands on a copy of the Junghans user manual. :(

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Re: Junghans 24/4610 High Tech Chrono - eBay Germany updates

Post by Seiko7A38 »

Here's updates on those 3 recent German eBay listings for Junghans 24/4610 High Tech Chrono's:

Not surprisingly, the first one went unsold yet again; the most recent 7-day re-listing ended yesterday evening:

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/224431512131

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The seller re-listed it almost immediately, by my reckoning for the 11th time, with the same unrealistic opening bid price of 249 Euros, but as a 10-day listing. A couple of hours later, he reduced the opening bid price to 'only' 199 Euros.

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/224443599101

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That NOS condition example sold on Tuesday evening for the Buy-it-Now price of 295 Euros.

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/174723613513

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The 5-day auction for the rather grubby-looking example, with instruction manual and warranty booklet, ended a few moments ago, selling for 65.70 Euros after 21 bids.

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/363373001472

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Re: Junghans 24/4610 High Tech Chrono - My incoming NOS !!

Post by Seiko7A38 »

I have a confession to make. :oops: Although two of my four Junghans 24/4610's are in fairly presentable condition, neither could be described as close to mint. I fancied that NOS example which was listed on eBay Germany in the first week of April. So I emailed the seller, in German, politely asking if he'd be prepared to make an exception and ship to the UK.
Seiko7A38 wrote: Mon Apr 26, 2021 12:49 pmUnfortunately, one of the 'benefits' of Brexit, is that German eBay sellers now seem even more reluctant to deal with UK, than they were before we left the EU. :roll: Both this (and the previous) German seller are blocking bids from UK ! :x
He replied: "Sorry, EU only". :x Not wanting to pass it up, after a giving it a bit of thought, I messaged German forum member Uhrige7A (a.k.a. Finn, whom I'd dealt with before) and asked if he would buy it on my behalf. He very kindly obliged, including re-packing it to a very professional standard. ;) It arrived yesterday.

The watch is everything I'd expected. Absolutely mint, with not a mark on the vulnerable gold plated bezel. I haven't taken a wrist shot yet, because it has a full length bracelet with the full complement of adjustment links. I probably need to remove at least one, possibly two, to get a decent fit. Looking back at the German eBay seller's photos ....

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Although much of it's been cropped out, I suspect he mounted it on one of those grey plastic Junghans stands, like this:

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Re: Junghans 24/4610 High Tech Chrono - that 990 DM Price Tag

Post by Seiko7A38 »

I wanted it as much for the accessories as its own sake. That thin card hang tag has done well to survive 30-odd years.

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Seiko7A38 wrote: Mon Apr 26, 2021 11:51 amNote that the full catalogue number is 024/4610.44 .... same as printed on the paper hang tag in a current eBay listing in a subsequent post. That also shows a retail price of 990 DM (equivalent to approx. 500 Euros).
Using the standard Deutsche Mark / Euro conversion rate of DM 1.95583 = €1 fixed on 31 December 1998 = 506.18 Euros.

But how much was the Deutsche Mark actually worth in 1989 ? :?

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Looking at it simplistically, depending which online inflation checker tool used and whether you enter DM's or Euros ....

http://www.lawyerdb.de/Inflationrate.aspx

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https://www.inflationtool.com/euro-germany

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That 1989 r.r.p. of 990 D-Marks comps out between 862 and 888.5 Euros in today's money, which doesn't seem that bad.
Finn had already commented on the r.r.p. in an earlier Instagram conversation, saying that he considered it was high.
He sent me this screenshot today; a result from another site: https://www.altersvorsorge-und-inflatio ... echner.php

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Taking an average of the three 'adjusted for inflation' results gives a nice round figure of 890 Euros in today's money.

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Re: Junghans 24/4610 High Tech Chrono - the miniature manual

Post by Seiko7A38 »

Seiko7A38 wrote: Mon Apr 26, 2021 12:49 pmI would have relished the opportunity to bid on this one, to get my hands on a copy of the Junghans user manual. :(
The eagerly anticipated Junghans instruction manual turned out to be something of a disappointment. :( I'd already figured it might be small (from the other German eBay auction listing's primary image). I just hadn't realized how tiny. It measures 85mm wide by 40mm deep. That's compared to a Seiko 7A38 user manual which measures 115mm x 80mm.

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It's printed in a grey font throughout (which makes it harder to read) on the thinnest cheapest quality paper imaginable. It's almost transparent, like rice paper. :cry:

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There are 5 language sections: German, English, French, Spanish and Italian, which suggests Junghans had intended to export this model. No great surprise that the illustrations are exactly the same as you'll find in the Seiko 7A38 manual.

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Re: Junghans 24/4610 High Tech Chrono - the presentation box

Post by Seiko7A38 »

Seiko7A38 wrote: Mon Apr 26, 2021 11:53 amI haven't had any success finding pukka related accessories for them, in terms of the correct original presentation box,
The presentation box supplied with the NOS Junghans 24/4610 also turned out to be something of a disappointment. :(

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I'd had my doubts about the period authenticity of the box, before I decided to buy the watch. It just looked a bit too new to my eyes. It's a generic Junghans cardboard box with a velour pillow. It fits the watch well enough I suppose. :|

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It came with a slightly grubby outer cardboard sleeve, which wasn't shown in the German eBay seller's photos:

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The white paper label seemed a bit newer. I wasted a few minutes googling those numbers before I turned it over. :roll:

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There's a Junghans point of sale label underneath, with the model code 029/4420.00. Googling 29/4420 reveals this was a much later ana-digi Junghans Mega Chrono Alarm Funkuhr, which first appeared in the Junghans catalogue from 1995.

My problem in finding the correct original presentation box for a 24/4610 High Tech Chrono stems from ignorance. :oops: You see, I don't know if Junghans actually bothered producing specific packaging for this relatively short-lived model. They certainly have done for others, like this albeit rather later model, 29/7400 Mega Chrono Alarm, which has been listed on eBay Germany for nearly a year and remains unsold:

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I've seen that generic light grey and red inner box used on much earlier models. Note the elaborately printed outer box. I've been running searches on 'Junghans Uhrenbox' on eBay Germany for a while, but have still not found what (I think) I'm looking for. :( There are literally dozens of these Junghans Travel / Service clamshell zipper cases on there ....

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.... but I've steadfastly resisted the temptation. Like many other manufacturers, modern-day Junghans boxes are huge.

Googling has also turned up a few interesting possibilities, like this slim quartz box that seems to be 'period correct'.

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However, that wouldn't be suitable for a heavier watch on a bracelet. Note also the familiar 'slimline' manual. :roll:

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But the one that really caught my eye was this SEIKO blue spring-loaded clamshell Junghans box for a 1991 Mega 1. :shock:

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It bears an uncanny resemblance to an Orient presentation box that one of my first J39's came in.

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Note the paragraph at the bottom of that Junghans Mega 1 webpage (and ignore the typo's):

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The 'PD Book' referred to is: History of the Modern Wristwatch, by Pieter Doensen, published in 1994.

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Re: Junghans 24/4610 High Tech Chrono - Oops I bought another

Post by Seiko7A38 »

Seiko7A38 wrote: Fri Apr 30, 2021 6:20 pm Here's updates on those 3 recent German eBay listings for Junghans 24/4610 High Tech Chrono's:

The 5-day auction for the rather grubby-looking example, with instruction manual and warranty booklet, ended a few moments ago, selling for 65.70 Euros after 21 bids.

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/363373001472

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Seiko7A38 wrote: Sun May 09, 2021 2:30 pmI have a confession to make. :oops: Although two of my four Junghans 24/4610's are in fairly presentable condition ....
I have another confession to make. :oops: I caved in and bought the other grubby one, with manuals and suspect hands. :roll:
Seiko7A38 wrote: Mon Apr 26, 2021 11:51 amI've never been averse to two-tones myself and quite like them, personally.
Yes - I concede this was yet another instance of my not needing another example, but I never could resist a bargain. :P
Finn had already purchased the NOS example on my behalf, but I'd added this other German eBay listing to my watching page, because it also included the Junghans instruction manual and additionally the warranty leaflet (of more anon). :)
Although there had been 20 bids placed by half a dozen different bidders, the high bid was still less at than 65 Euros. So I thought 'what the heck' and chucked in a 'throwaway' snipe bid of 67.89 Euros and won the auction for 65.70 Euros. :D

Finn kindly acted as my post-Brexit forwarding agent, once again and the postman delivered his package yesterday. ;)
Finn has already forewarned me that the bracelet appeared to be very long (which usually means stretch or worn pins) and that two of the pushers didn't work. For the price I paid, I wasn't complaining. That said, it was incredibly grubby.

I did consider creating a short separate topic in the Workshop section, but as this is really little more than a strip and clean exercise, I elected to insert it as another couple of posts, here in the existing Junghans thread. I made a start yesterday afternoon, by dismantling and removing all the bracelet adjustment links. I'd previously earmarked one of them as being 'surplus to requirements' - needed for another of my 24/4610's whose bracelet was slightly too short.

You may recall this 'word to the wise' from my lengthy first post:
Seiko7A38 wrote: Mon Apr 26, 2021 11:51 amMeaning that if you're planning to work on one, you'd be wise to invest a quid (£1) in a pack of Cousins p/n P20857P. ;)

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Case in point: the first 4 split pins I pushed out were all very badly worn - and bar one, which I discarded as a matter of course, split into two halves. One pin was extremely reluctant to be pushed out. Turned out that some well-meaning botcher had replaced it with a length of brass wire. Instead of coming out cleanly on the other side, it bent double, inside the centre link section. Took me a while to extract. :x That's what remains of it on the left of the photo. :roll:

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Seiko7A38 wrote: Mon Apr 26, 2021 11:51 am The way I've gotten around it, when either cleaning or working on a 24/4610, is to leave both halves of the bracelet attached to the case, but shorten it, by pushing out the two 1.0mm Ø split pins nearest the case, thereby removing the adjustment links and butterfly clasp, which makes it less unwieldy.
The initial clean-up, which simply involved painstakingly scraping off the years of accumulated crud, using the point(s) of a (good few) wooden cocktail stick(s) provided encouraging results after an hour or so's work:

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Although I'll naturally be stripping and cleaning the pushers, which like everything else are clogged up with 30 years of DNA, I think I've found the probable cause of the partial chronograph operation. The press-in case-back wasn't pressed fully home so was easy to lever off, once I'd cleaned the gunge from around it. Look what I discovered inside !! :roll:

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A cheap and nasty Chamelion LR921 (#371 sized) battery !! :o To call its fitment 'tenuous' would be an understatement. It fell out when I turned the watch over. :lol: I've since fitted a Seizaiken #394 battery and all the hands can be moved / reset using the cams of the switch levers. So there's nothing wrong with the movement itself. :) However, I'm a little disappointed with myself for my earlier incorrect assessment of the watch's hands (based on the eBay seller's photos).
Seiko7A38 wrote: Mon Apr 26, 2021 12:49 pmIt's suffering from the common malady of manky hands lume (caused by poor case sealing, allowing moisture ingress) ...
They're not suffering from manky lume - or if they were, it's been hidden. They've been painted black - rather gobbily !!

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Need a hand ? Well it just so happened I had a couple up my sleeve. :) I'd forgotten that I had a working spare Junghans V906 dial / movement in my spares box, which had a reasonably good pair of hands on it. I could easily have just fitted it as a complete drop in replacement, but the dial had some staining around its perimeter from moisture ingress, so ....

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As the dial from the 'grubby' one was in much better condition, I pulled the painted hands and swapped them over ....

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I deliberately flipped over the painted hour hand in that photo. As you can see there was nothing wrong with the lume (in fact, on either hand). One can only assume that the previous owner had difficulty seeing the gold plated hands. :roll:

This has to have been one of the filthiest watches I've had the disgusting displeasure to work on in a long time. After I'd carefully scraped away the worst of the crud, it took more scrubbing, rinsing and dabbing away with Rodico to get it to a reasonable standard of cleanliness. There were even bits of detritus under the crystal and around the top edge of the Tachymeter ring. Presumably they got in there when the watch-botcher had opened up the case to paint the hands.

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When I was sure the case was completely clean and dry, I tentatively offered up the dial / movement, only to discover that there was a small scratch on the crystal, visible just above the 55 second mark on the constant seconds sub-dial. I can't believe I missed spotting it before. It was probably covered by the greasy film on the crystal, before I cleaned it !

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I thought I had a new Sternkreuz MSM 304 crystal in stock, but when I popped it out of the packet, it turned out to be a used original Junghans crystal that I must have removed from one of my other 24/4610's. It had a couple of tiny chips on the edge and another in the middle. I'd obviously deemed it too good to throw away. :roll: I'm annoyed with myself. :x

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There's absolutely no point in replacing a scratched crystal with another slightly damaged one. I've now belatedly annotated the packet and will add another Sternkreuz MSM304 to my next Cousins order. It'll have do do for now.

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Re: Junghans 24/4610 High Tech Chrono - Also available in 1987

Post by Seiko7A38 »

Before I decided to buy the NOS example, there was another reason I was interested in this lesser condition 24/4610 ....
Seiko7A38 wrote: Mon Apr 26, 2021 12:49 pmThis average worn condition example, with user manual and warranty booklet, was listed yesterday evening ....
.... it included the warranty booklet, which was missing from the NOS example's set. Like the user instruction manual, it's tiny - exactly the same dimensions: 85mm wide by 40mm deep. But at least this one's printed in black, not grey.

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I was intrigued to learn what it showed for Junghans' UK service centre: an anonymous P.O. Box number in Biggleswade.

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Long since defunct - that postcode SG18 8LN (Wiseman Road) is now a modern private housing estate, so presumably the whole area was redeveloped years ago.

The watch was purchased from Uhren Sonntag in Sendlinger Str., Munich and they may still actually exist as a company.

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But hang on a minute, check the date of purchase 5,10,87 - 5th October 1987.

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Remember what I'd written in my first lengthy post ?
Seiko7A38 wrote: Mon Apr 26, 2021 11:51 amThese watches were presumably manufactured in late 1987 or 1988 ....
That said, it seems to have been a fairly short-lived arrangement.
When I browsed Junghans online archive, a fortnight or so ago, I'd found illustrations of the 024/4610.44 in their 1988 and 1989 catalogues, but nowhere else. In fact, I don't remember finding a full Junghans 1987 catalogue. Based on the date shown on that warranty booklet of October 1987, I decided a revisit was in order. I'm not sure how I overlooked it before, but this afternoon I found this 8-page Junghans brochure which appears to have been produced in conjunction with Kross, a family jewellers of Walsrode, Lower Saxony. Pages 4 and 5 announce the new >>High Tech<< Collection.

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Re: Junghans 24/4610 High Tech Chrono - My collection update

Post by Seiko7A38 »

Seiko7A38 wrote: Mon Apr 26, 2021 11:53 am My little collection of them (4 so far). Left to right, in the order I acquired them, first 3 in 2011 and far right in 2018. The best condition example is third from left, which started out as a 'freebee' empty case and bracelet (see below). :)

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I guess all that remains to finish off the thread, is for me to add a 'small' collection update. :)

Top Row are the 3 that I acquired in 2011. Left to Right: The first (now rectified) Wrong Un', the one I that bought from German eBay seller bergjodler58 (fitted with a donor dial / movement) and Klaus's 'freebee' surprise Christmas present. Note the three different styles of sweep second hand fitted (all are correct). 8-)

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Bottom Row, left to right: the one I bought on a whim in 2018; the recently acquired 'grubby' one and my NOS example.
They're all fitted with the same, most common sweep second hand (which appears very similar to Seiko p/n 13SC04AB).

It was the devil's own job capturing all six watches in reasonably sharp focus and suitably lit (blame my equipment). :P The NOS example is still on its original full length bracelet (with two more adjustment links than all the others), so was reluctant to sit properly. Just when I thought I'd got the perfect shot, I noticed something looked awry with the top LH outer bracelet link on the 'grubby' one. It's just a bit of lint and reflections. Trust me, it's fine. ;) That will have to do !
Seiko7A38 wrote: Mon Apr 26, 2021 11:53 amChecking my records, I've paid less than 100 Euros each for any of them (between 46 and 94 Euros) ....
Obviously, having splashed out 295 Euros on the NOS example, I've completely blown my previous average price paid. :oops: However, if you'll allow me that indulgence and exclude it from the equation, even accounting for not one, but the two cheap beater 'head only' donors I've purchased for their dial / movements (I'd previously overlooked the second I bought in 2019), my average price paid for the other 5 used condition examples is still below my self-imposed €100 limit. :mrgreen:

PS - It's unlikely that I'll be buying any more Junghans 24/4610 High Tech's in the future. Six is enough for anybody !! :lol: However, if I ever happen to see one with the correct original presentation box, I may have to make an exception. :P

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Re: Junghans 24/4610 High Tech Chrono - The box continued ....

Post by Seiko7A38 »

Meanwhile the quest for that elusive 'period correct' Junghans presentation box continues ....
Seiko7A38 wrote: Tue May 11, 2021 7:56 amMy problem in finding the correct original presentation box for a 24/4610 High Tech Chrono stems from ignorance. :oops:
Initially, I'd only been searching for an alternative 'suitable period' Junghans presentation box on eBay Germany, which seemed logical to me. However, extending my eBay searches to 'worldwide' has produced a couple more possibilities.

This grey plastic Junghans box was listed in April by an Italian seller. The fuzzy felt covering seems to have shrunk ! :(

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This rather more attractive-looking Junghans box, covered in navy blue vinyl, has been listed by a Spanish eBay seller since March 10th this year. He describes it as being 'AÑOS 60-70', but the design looks more like the 1980's to my eye.

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The horizontal mounting loop is similar to those found in both Cartier Ferrari Formula and FRED Force 10 watch boxes. The seller also describes it as being 'MIB' (Mint in Box). :roll: Grubbiness apart (it could conceivably have once held the 'grubby' Junghans 24/4610 that I purchased recently, or an equally dirty watch), I could have quite fancied that one. Looking at the listing on eBay.es, with a Buy-it-Now price of 29 Euros (plus 7 Euros shipping within Spain), it's already expensive. Viewing it on eBay.co.uk, you'd expect 20% VAT to have been automatically added to the price by eBay, which indeed it has, increasing that to €34.80, but the shipping has now shot up to an astonishing 50.40 Euros ! :shock:

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Re: Junghans 24/4610 High Tech Chrono - eBay Germany updates

Post by Seiko7A38 »

Seiko7A38 wrote: Fri Apr 30, 2021 6:20 pmNot surprisingly, the first one went unsold yet again; the most recent 7-day re-listing ended yesterday evening:

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/224431512131

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The seller re-listed it almost immediately, by my reckoning for the 11th time, with the same unrealistic opening bid price of 249 Euros, but as a 10-day listing. A couple of hours later, he reduced the opening bid price to 'only' 199 Euros.

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/224443599101

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I wasn't planning to mention this remaining unsold Junghans 24/4610 High Tech again. Yesterday evening, the hapless German eBay seller had re-listed it for the 13th (unlucky) time, once again as a 10-day auction with the same 'reduced' opening bid of 199 Euros. I thought no more of it and mechanically added it to my eBay watching page. This afternoon I received an unusual eBay notification. He appears to have totally lost the plot at lunchtime today, revised the listing, increasing the previously reduced 199 Euros opening bid price to 499 Euros !! :lol:

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Sehr-hochwer ... 4467342796

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In case you missed it, that's higher than his risible 'pie-in-the-sky' Buy-it-Now price of 450 Euros in his original listing !!
Seiko7A38 wrote: Mon Apr 26, 2021 12:32 pmThis average condition example has been re-listed by the German eBay seller, ad nauseam since 7th February this year. Like his subsequent re-listings, it was a 7-day auction, originally with a highly over-optimistic opening bid price of 299 Euros, initially with the absolutely ludicrous option to Buy-it-Now for 450 Euros ! :lol:

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Junghans-Hig ... 4343345861

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Re: Junghans 24/4610 High Tech Chrono - The box continued ....

Post by Seiko7A38 »

Seiko7A38 wrote: Wed May 19, 2021 1:35 pmThis rather more attractive-looking Junghans box, covered in navy blue vinyl, has been listed by a Spanish eBay seller since March 10th this year. He describes it as being 'AÑOS 60-70', but the design looks more like the 1980's to my eye.

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Grubbiness apart (it could conceivably have once held the 'grubby' Junghans 24/4610 that I purchased recently, or an equally dirty watch), I could have quite fancied that one ....
.... which indeed it has, increasing that to €34.80, but the shipping has now shot up to an astonishing 50.40 Euros ! :shock:
I managed to find another example of the same navy blue Junghans presentation box, listed by another Spanish eBay seller. It was about the same price (with VAT added) but a lot cleaner inside and postage costs were more reasonable.

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Perhaps I should have taken more careful notice of the dimensions. :|

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It arrived earlier this week. It's a nice little box. 'Little' being the operative word. :( It measures a mere 92mm wide (as shown roughly in the eBay seller's last photo), by 75mm deep and just over 50mm tall. The watch mounting loop, being closed up, gave a false impression of the box being much bigger. That's my excuse anyway. :roll:
Seiko7A38 wrote: Fri May 14, 2021 3:20 pm.... it included the warranty booklet, which was missing from the NOS example's set. Like the user instruction manual, it's tiny - exactly the same dimensions: 85mm wide by 40mm deep.
More by luck than judgement I found it was just possible to slide the warranty leaflet underneath the mounting loop. :)

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Note that I'd already expanded the mounting loop to better suit the length of the bracelet.

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That isn't my NOS example on the full length bracelet, but the ex-Klaus 'surprise freebee', which like my other 24/4610's has had 2 adjustment links removed. It's possible to place the instruction manual above the bracelet and close the box.

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Re: Junghans 24/4610 High Tech Chrono - on the PD book

Post by Seiko7A38 »

Seiko7A38 wrote: Tue May 11, 2021 7:56 amThe 'PD Book' referred to is: History of the Modern Wristwatch, by Pieter Doensen, published in 1994.
I must admit to having googled that 'Watch' book by Pieter Doensen at the time. But I was put off by the prices some secondhand book dealers were asking (a couple around £150). That apart, I didn't expect it to contain any reference to the Junghans High Tech Chrono (let alone any other quartz chronographs). I'd moved on and all but forgotten about it. Then, by chance, I was idly browsing TZ-UK's Sales Corner last week and saw someone had recently advertised a copy.

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The seller was asking £85, but evidently wasn't having any success.
Like the book but not the price? A reasonable offer will buy it.
So I made one, which he accepted. :) Thank you Jack. ;) The postman delivered his bulletproof package this morning.
Seiko7A38 wrote: Wed May 19, 2021 10:48 amThe NOS example is still on its original full length bracelet (with two more adjustment links than all the others) ....
As it happened, when the knock at the door came, I was in the middle of removing an adjustment link (not two) from my NOS Junghans 24/4610 High Tech Chrono. So when I'd unpacked it, I took this quick snap of it on the book's cover.

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I've since had a very quick flick through the book and it's as I'd expected. There's plenty of reference to Junghans' other more technically advanced models and a couple of brief mentions of Seiko's 7Axx chronographs, including a small photo of a gold-tone 7A28-7029 'head only' at the bottom of page 198. You'd have thought the author would have been able to come up with something better than that. :roll:

Perhaps instead of sharing my knowledge online, I should consider writing 'the definitive book' on 7A38's and derivatives. Question is: would I ever be able to find a willing publisher for such an 'epic tome', as a hard copy in this digital age ? :?

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Re: Junghans 24/4610 High Tech Chrono - Rückwärts Nicht Technik

Post by Seiko7A38 »

Seiko7A38 wrote: Sat Aug 21, 2021 9:50 am This morning, I re-read the lengthy Junghans 24/4610 High Tech Chrono thread. I was going to add another post to the effect that deluded German eBay seller chribay77's example still remained unsold (he'd re-listed it yet again two days ago, with the opening bid price 'reduced' to 349 Euros). But I decided not to bother. :roll:
Instead, I decided it was about time I gave him a reality check, so I sent him an eBay message, pointing out that when he'd listed it as a 10-day auction in early May, with an opening bid price of 199 Euros it had failed to attract any bids.
Seiko7A38 wrote: Fri Apr 30, 2021 6:20 pmThe seller re-listed it almost immediately, by my reckoning for the 11th time, with the same unrealistic opening bid price of 249 Euros, but as a 10-day listing. A couple of hours later, he reduced the opening bid price to 'only' 199 Euros.

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/224443599101

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I also included a link to this thread, as an indicator of realistic selling prices. But I doubt it will make any difference ....

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Re: Junghans 24/4610 High Tech Chrono - Rückwärts Nicht Technik

Post by Seiko7A38 »

Remiss of me for not following up on that previous post. I do remember the German eBay seller chribay77 re-listing it at least a couple more times, to no avail. But then he just stopped for no obvious reason. There's no sign of it (or the other Junghans watches he was listing) in his feedback.

As you've probably gathered, Junghans High Tech Chrono's rarely come up for sale (on eBay or anywhere else) outside their native Germany. Last week I was surprised to see one offered by a UK eBay seller. That said, it wasn't the best of examples, being a 'head only', a non-runner and missing one pusher. It was listed as a 5-day auction with an opening bid price of £10. I did think about buying it for spares, but the bidding soon went well beyond what I was prepared to pay* for such an example, selling for £67.89 after 10 bids. I suspect it was the seller's inclusion of '7A38' in his listing title that helped it to achieve that figure.

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/144570968243

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Judging by the staining on the movement back-plate (and the positive battery plate, which is missing its 'ears'), it appears to have suffered a localized but fairly catastrophic battery leak, so I suspect the PCB will be toast.

*That's rather more than I paid for my grubby but complete example last April.

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